English Football and other Nations in the UK

[Ascension Ox]

Football is supposed to be a leisure activity, is there a suggestion that all English people have a responsibility to support the england team whatever?

I've watched England live on various occasions, apart from the games often being poor I also think it also brings out the worst in the supporters - the songs are often offensive, racist and/or xenophobic. It's rarely been a pleasurable experience and I'm certainly not predisposed to continue supporting them out of some strange sense of nationalism.

No , not a 'responsibiliy' to support per se. Support for England comes naturally to most people. Nearly all of whom are, not, quote, 'slavering nationalists'.

[Pe├▒a Oxford United]

This &quotGolden Generation&quot thing. I've obviously missed this. Who in God's name has actually been calling them that?

[headless_pnub]

During the world cup that's what the team were supposed to be. &quotThe best team since '66&quot I believe.

[Isaac]

This &quotGolden Generation&quot thing. I've obviously missed this. Who in God's name has actually been calling them that?

Sky mainly I think and probably The Sun.

[Pe├▒a Oxford United]

Jesus.

[Pe├▒a Oxford United]

For what it's worth (and I'm not an England fan) I'd say the following:

1. England has a strong football culture and produces many good players. There's no reason why the national side shouldn't do better than it does, but there are reasons why it's underperformed for thirty years.

2. One of these would be that its leading players are happy to go rabbit-shooting every weekend for a handful of top English clubs. When's the last time one of them went abroad for a genuine challenge, to develop himself? Even the best need to learn. Kevin Keegan understood this.

3. The big clubs have far too much power compared to the national team coach who rarely if ever gets to play his best players for ninety minutes in a friendly. English teams always look disjointed - that's maybe why.

4. English football is dismally unwilling to learn from outsiders. It always struck me, during the three decades in which England never came ahead of the Germans in a major championship, that you rarely if ever heard anybody saying &quotwhat can we learn from them? Pity's sake! You want to get better, then try and learn from the best.

Doesn't mean &quotforeigners are better than us&quot: English football has plenty to offer. But any tradition will become stale if it isn't regularly enriched from outside.

5. In general, in British media culture, there is little desire to think thigns through, to discuss them thoughtfully, to tale about systems and structures. What happens instead, not just in football, is that everybody screams after the scapegoat of the day and keeps screaming until they're sacked. This means that nothing substantial is ever learned.

I think McLaren had to go because he wasn't up to the job. And I don't think people from the Hants FA (or whatever) should be picking his replacement. But I sure as hell don't think the newspapers should be picking one either. What happened with Scolari was disgraceful.

But does anybody epect any real lessons to be learned? I doubt it, because the real power lies with the money-makers, the top clubs, and they're not interested in learning lessons that don't suit them.

[Matt D]

Yes, why do you not support your national team in what is our national sport ? Sorry, but if everyone shared you attitude after last night's debacle we're finished as a major football nation.

Anything else?

i don't support the england football team as i don't feel the sense of connection i do to oxford united. that's largely down to being half-welsh, feeling uncomfortable with the grey area between national support and jingoism that often accompanies the 'england bandwagon', and the frustratingly myopic coverage of england in the press.

besides, i already give whole-hearted support to one team of perennial losers, and that's enough for me, but i respect your right to be a masochist!

[Werthers Original]

Like someone earlier in the thread I was again very struck by the similarities betwen England and OUFC. Croatia were even wearing Exeter's away strip! Is lone striker Crouch just a larger, slower version of Yemi, and is Wayne Bridge Jeannin in disguise?

But I can't believe all the people who say they aren't bothered that we haven't qualified for Euro 2008, and that they'll enjoy it just as much. Would they enjoy Grays vs Crawley or Farsley vs Altrincham as much as an OUFC game, as long as it was 'good football'?

[headless_pnub]

Would they enjoy Grays vs Crawley or Farsley vs Altrincham as much as an OUFC game, as long as it was 'good football'?

No, probably not. But I think that's the point.

I feel no attachment to the England team besides being the same nationality as the players, but I do feel attachment to Oxford.

[Ascension Ox]

Like someone earlier in the thread I was again very struck by the similarities betwen England and OUFC. Croatia were even wearing Exeter's away strip! Is lone striker Crouch just a larger, slower version of Yemi, and is Wayne Bridge Jeannin in disguise?

But I can't believe all the people who say they aren't bothered that we haven't qualified for Euro 2008, and that they'll enjoy it just as much. Would they enjoy Grays vs Crawley or Farsley vs Altrincham as much as an OUFC game, as long as it was 'good football'?

I can't believe it either. I'll be watching more cricket and playing more golf next summer. Euro 2008 will be of mere passing interest.

BTW Croatia have an excellent chance. I hope they win. I bet Russia will get to the QFs at least as well.

[Boogie]

I'm with Roy Keane on this. Nothing much wrong with the talent of the players just too may egos.

Playing a rookie keeper in goal and the wrong formation to put pressure on an excellent Croatia side did for us.

Apart from how good Croatia were what has not been mentioned is the difference Jamie Carragher could have made last night. For that alone McClaren had to go.

The desperate hoofing at the end really reminded me of the Us.

Still there's another millionaire now with an Oxford connection should we need another bail-out.

[DLT]

I am surprised that nobody has refered to the real scandal of last night's match and one Barwick should resign over.

The state of the pitch. Three weeks after an American Football game the pitch markings were still clearly visible. The sidelines were uncovered so all those hangers on at an American football game trashed the wings of the 'soccer' pitch.

800 million for a stadium to be proud of and we end up with Grays Athletic's pitch. And we have a sliding roof that doesn't cover the pitch, what the f*** is that all about.

[Jimski]

2. One of these would be that its leading players are happy to go rabbit-shooting every weekend for a handful of top English clubs. When's the last time one of them went abroad for a genuine challenge, to develop himself? Even the best need to learn. Kevin Keegan understood this.

This is the crux, I think. The problem isn't too many foreigners in the English league, as every renta-quote seems to claim, but rather too few English players willing to go and play in other leagues. So you have - overall- fewer English players playing in top flight league football around Europe, while players from other countries are in all kinds of different leagues.

[YF Dan]

Jimski, I don't think it's English players not wanting to play in other leagues, it's english players being a) not good enough and b) earning so much that no-one can afford them.

Would you pay £150k a week for someone who can't do the basics? No? Nor would the rest of Europe.

[Snake]

To be honest, if they scrapped ALL international football games I’d be happy, and there are two main reasons for me to say that:

1. Wales have not qualified for a tournament abroad in my lifetime, and with me being Welsh that’s a tad disappointing. I’ve been to a few England games but only as a part-time glory hunter.

2. The way domestic football schedules are messed about these days because of international commitments which means that ‘Match of the Day’ is not on every Saturday night during the footy season.